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Hakko FM-2023 hot tweezers vs JBC nano- impossible areas of iphone motherboards

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  • Hakko FM-2023 hot tweezers vs JBC nano- impossible areas of iphone motherboards

    I am discovering there are areas on iphone motherboards containing 01005 components that are inaccessible with Hakko hot tweezers. Please see attached pictures. In fact I couldn't get my Adafruit rhino RH11s(the tips on these straight tweezers are quite fine and usually serve me well) into the row of 01005s between Meson and Cumulus on iphone 6 to have a go with hot air. I am wondering how the JBC nano hot tweezers would fair in these situations? Have you used the JBC nano soldering station? The only other strategy seems to be to hot air off surrounding ICs/components to gain access.
    Attached Files

  • #2
    Ack! Those pictures, get those tweezers out of there or you will damage the chips! All of these areas are places where you work with just hot air. Tweezers are for connectors and random isolated components. Any tip small enough to fit will not have enough thermal mass to deliver sufficient heat. Hot air is the right tool for these jobs. Yes I have tried the JBC Nano--I personally didn't care for it and I haven't heard good things from a couple of people who bought it.

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    • #3
      Take for example, the last picture.....the row of 01005s between Meson and cumulus. Even my finest (just regular)tweezers ….. my rhino SW-11s(these have finer tips that the Erem E3SAs which proved a disappointment!) can't get in that gap to remove one of those 01005s with hot air. Is there a pair of tweezers with tips fine enough to do that? Otherwise I'm assuming the solution is to just temporarily remove the IC(creating all the hassle of a potential reball) to facilitate? Is this correct? Seems like overkill but when there's no other way.... I'm assuming just one of the everyday realities of motherboard repair.....

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      • #4
        If you have a reason to remove one of the "trailer park" caps between meson and cumulus it will be because you bridged it with solder when cleaning pads under meson (or cumulus, although we almost never change cumulus anymore). The solution is to notice this problem with crisp visual examination before you put meson on. With meson off, it is easy to clear these bridges. You should never be in a situation where you are having to do work on that row of capacitors with both meson and cumulus on the board.

        I think you might be looking for tools to solve problems that aren't really problems.

        If I noticed that there was a bridge on a trailer park cap and meson was on the board, I would remove meson to clear the bridge. This would be assuming that the board boots and has a dead line of touch. If not, i would solve all other problems first and only come back to this problem if it was the last problem standing.

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        • #5
          Thanks for that. Sound advice from a pro clears up alot of niggleys.

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          • #6
            This glowing comment from the guys at microsoldering.com regards the JBC NASE-1C Nano Rework Station 2 Tools keeps nagging my mind. Particularly as Hakko have retired their FM-2023 hot tweezers(sooner or later the tip supplies for these have got to run out)

            "Best microsoldering station that one can buy. I switched to this JBC unit from the Hakko. The tips are alignable and the micro-pencil actually heats well. I don't use any Hakko soldering products anymore because the JBC stuff is THAT much better.".
            He also make the comment that the difference between these and the Hakko's is like the difference between night and day.

            Have you used this exact same station?
            Last edited by Jessa_the_Professa; 06-03-2020, 01:05 PM.

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            • Jessa_the_Professa
              Jessa_the_Professa commented
              Editing a comment
              Yes--Mark and I both did not care for it. Another guy that switched to it really really really regrets it---because the tips are expensive and he is constantly having to replace them. But I'm sure there are lots of people who like it just fine, just like Coke and Pepsi.

          • #7
            The tips on my Hakko FM-2023s don't touch together. This has always nagged me. Often on the ipad rehab videos you would touch the ends of your hakko hot tweezers on a as you need basis to create a tip with greater thermal mass and separate them when you wanted a smaller tip but...... I guess in that scenario you were really using them like the convenience of two different soldering irons at your fingertips rather than as hot tweezers......

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            • Jessa_the_Professa
              Jessa_the_Professa commented
              Editing a comment
              Tips change over time and different tip sets are different out of the wrapper. Sometimes they line up, sometimes they don't and you have to push one or the other up or back in order to make them aligned.

          • #8
            Thanks for that opinion and advice - invaluable. It is easy to bow to JBC products and be overawed by their reputation. And if Hakko is a Coke then JBC makes for a really expensive Pepsi! And at the end of the day it is just how useful one finds a tool "working from the the trenches" that really matters. I would have found micro tweeezers most useful removing and restoring caps and coils in densely, tightly packed areas of the motherboard but I remember from a previous response you made on this post that this is not practical. But I'm still not sure why Hakko have discontinued the FM2023s, I don't think they had any feasible competition in their price range. That only leaves the JBCs and micro tweezers, while they still have their uses, aren't quite as useful as I originally believed them to be.

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            • #9
              Ok. Getting down to some practicalities. I'm not sure I understood your previous advice of push pulling tweezer tips to get them aligned so only tried what I think you were saying. The only "latitude" for adjusting the tips to make them touch, or at least sit closer, is to pull one of the tips a little up out of it's flange. I would have thought that this would make the FM203 signal an SE and beep like crazy(like when you don't push a soldering iron tip properly into it's socket)...but it didn't. In this state, with one tip now extending beyond the other, to be able to touch both ends of a cap, coil or resistor the tweezers need to be held angled. Ok. But the scope of adjustment is limited. With one tip now longer than the other, push it out too much(it doesn't take much) and, the shorter tip flies right over the top of the component never to touch it's side. The primary function ie hot "tweezers" is defeated.
              I don't know. In my case I think maybe the tips I inhertited when I purchased the hot tweezers are already too far apart to make this "workaround" feasible. Or maybe not. I could abandon the idea of touching the ends together and using them like a micro soldering iron but this is actually a very useful function. I have heard microsolderers claim they abandoned their Hakko micro iron (as useless) and exclusively used their FM2023s.... tips together instead. Left to the Hakko standard 70 watt iron, the smallest chisel tip available is 1mm, which I have found is sometimes too large. You can use the Hakko JS tip(the short stubby one has a enough thermal transfer see picture) to sometimes pull off tinning 1005 pads in very tight (densely packed)spaces but pressing the two tips of the FM2023s, if they would come together would, I'm sure, do nicely for ALL situations. At the end of the day the core issue becomes one of thermal transfer .... it's got to be able to apply enough heat to the area to do the job. So what's your opinion of my workaround picture? Is it just that I inherited a set of really bad tweezer tips? First time round?
              Attached Files

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              • Jessa_the_Professa
                Jessa_the_Professa commented
                Editing a comment
                I think that you need more practice, less worry about details. The answer to all these questions is "go play" If you really are frustrated with something and you want to know "How do I do this" then come ask. Every microsolderer is different. Everyone has their own style. A good microsolderer only became that way through a shit ton of practice. Make your tweezers work for you in a dedicated one hour session of trying to play with them. If they don't work for you, abandon them and try something else. Maybe this new idea of one long leg is a great tip that you've discovered. Maybe it is crap. Only one way to find out. Get busy!

            • #10
              Thanks for the response ... I was really clarifying your previous response......
              Tips change over time and different tip sets are different out of the wrapper. Sometimes they line up, sometimes they don't and you have to push one or the other up or back in order to make them aligned.

              What I did in my picture while it got the tips closer together didn't actually make them touch, and as it looks "new" to you is obviously not what you meant. The only other option I see then is to get something(a pair of pliers?) and bend the tips to make them touch I'm just feeling nancy about trying that right now as they're my only set of tips (I'm scared of breaking them)

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              • #11
                if you want to line up the tips and they don’t naturally align, then grip the tweezers as if you were going to solder something, put the tips together under the microscope, then just press them against the mat so that they are aligned for a second. That’s what I meant.

                I would not worry about tips. It doesn’t matter if they line up or not.

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                • #12
                  Ok thanks for that I'll give it a try. Line up or not. You mean it doesn't matter whether they touch or not? I just took another look at one of your old videos "How to replace any iPhone logic board connector". And.... when you brought the hot tweezer tips "together" to puff up the pads(about 9 minutes into the video) I just noticed... they were very close but not actually touching(any more than mine).Looks like I trolled myself with a "fixation"

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